Magical Spin Casino - プレイヤーはボーナス条件に違反したとして告発されました。

I joined this casino in begging of April 2020 ,I have first deposit and used bonus on the 9th I won 2000 euros hence they were cancelling my request ,as apparently my account wasn’t verified so as that kept happening I got tempted and played again with those winnings and lost it all.I decided not to play for two weeks than I made two deposits on 24.04 of 100€ each and won 2000€ from it no bonus involved at all ,hence after they cancelled again I had to put through another request on Sunday 26,now after 3 days they cancelled all stating that I breach bonus conditions etc !! What bonus?? I had not took any bonus but they keep saying I gain my winnings from first deposit and now stopped replying to me!!! This is scandalous

Additional comments from the player:

"Now they saying that my account had bonus balance in it while I made my winnings ,this absolutely shocking -I made deposit of 50€ the day before and had bonus of 75€ played through on that day and hour later lost it all next day I made two deposits one of 100€ lost it again and another 35 minutes later where my winnings came from (no any bonus taken) now they even send me screen shot showing the bonus which suddenly appeared in my balance on 25/04 at 4:20 am and refusing to pay my winnings"

Dear Joanna,

Thank you very much for submitting your complaint. I’m sorry to hear about your problem. Please allow me to ask you a few questions, so I can understand the whole situation completely. When you have lost all the winnings from your first deposit bonus, went your balance to zero or there were some funds left? If your account is still accessible, could you please forward me your game history? My email address is petronela.k@casino.guru. I hope we will be able to help you to resolve this issue as soon as possible. Thank you in advance for your reply.

Best regards,

Petronela

Thank you for your response ,my account is still accessible ,how I can forward on here my bet history ,I’m quite positive that my bonus balance from the day prior to winnings when I deposit 50€ was all played through -I think it was 63 cents left when I deposited next day on 24.04 100€ but I lost that one too ,next deposit of also 100€ was when I made my winnings from and I’m certain there wasn’t any bonus left there ,how come they can just rollover this bonus for other deposits I play for more then 10 years in casinos online and never came across that ,even so some of them deduct bonuses from winnings but certainly in my case there wasn’t bonus in my account balance ,hence I’m absolutely devastated as in pandemic times I was counting on that winnings and now I don’t know what else to do as they stopped replying to my demands

Dear Joanna,

Thank you very much for your reply. You can forward your game history to petronela.k@casino.guru. Thank you in advance.

Thank you very much Joanna for your quick reply via email. I will now transfer your complaint to my colleague Juli who will be at your assistance. I wish you best of luck and hope to see your problem being resolved to your satisfaction in the near future.

Hello Joanna,

I’m sorry to hear about your problem. Please could you forward me any supporting evidence? We really want to help you to resolve this unpleasant situation, but we will need your game history or screenshots of it. My email address is yuliia.k@guruadmins.com

Thank you very much in advance for your reply.

Sure ,I can provide you with the maybe login as I can’t download history there at all ?Is that gonna help ?

Hello Joanna,

Thank you very much for your reply. In this case we will try to contact the casino to find more information.

Hi,

I have requested the players information from support and risk management.

We will respond soon as possible.

Levi

Communications manager

Magical Spin Casino.

Yes but they will send you their bogus excel sheet showing bonus of 75€ in the balance playing which is incorrect and they are simply applying old bonus to new deposits not to pay out!

Still no response

Hi,

We did respond over a week ago.

We received a message that it was being reviewed by the forum.

Levi H

Communications manager.

I haven’t seen this response posted here

Hi Joanna,

I do not see the response either, I will try to speak with CasinoGuru and make sure that the response was not lost.

Please know, that as a French player you have no wager on bonus and the only requirement is that you may not bet more than 7.50 during the session which contains both your deposit and bonus. The only way to end a session is to either win and withdraw or to play your balance to zero.

Making another deposit on top of a existing session "Meaning you still had funds in the account being a small amount or large does not cancel the session. This triggered the max bet condition "over-bet rule" being violated. So by making a deposit and over-betting you breached the terms and conditions of receiving a bonus.

Terms and conditions.

7.5 If a bonus has been claimed, the maximum bet allowed is €/CAD 7.5, over the entire game session relating to the deposit having benefited from the bonus (both real/bonus balances). This rule also applies to the free spins or bonus-games a player can buy directly from a game since the amount of the purchase is considered as the amount of the bet.

For your convenience the rule in French.

https://www.magicalspin.com/fr/bonus-terms

7.5 Lorsqu'un bonus a été obtenu, la mise maximale autorisée est de 7.5 €/CAD, sur toute la session relative au dépôt ayant bénéficié du bonus (toute balances confondues). Cette règle s'applique également aux tours gratuits ou aux jeux bonus qu'un joueur peut acheter directement d'un jeu, car le montant de l'achat est considéré comme le montant de la mise.

I hope this clears up the reason the session was canceled which removed all gains.

Levi H

Communications maanager.

This is just not right ,balance was 63cents while I made second deposit hence I lost it all so there was no way it was still there when I made third deposit -no other casinos does that it’s simply cheating customers imposing sticky bonus -like this one bonus could apply to 100 deposits after and player will not cash ever their winnings ,if everything was like you saying was -how come after cancelling my withdrawal and refusing to pay out they put 100€ in my account balance to play with! Clearly they were in wrong and that is why as I didn’t participate in any cash back promotion ,so I will make complaint to gaming commission further -for balance of 63 cents they applied full bonus for 3 deposits!!! I will make sure this won’t happen to other honest players

If you were honest casino you will make honest decision about this and pay out properly if I knew this 63 cents still applied obviously I wouldn’t bet higher than 7.5 as I’m not stupid to lose my winnings ,very clever and slick so customers can’t prove you wrong

"Making another deposit on top of a existing session "Meaning you still had funds in the account being a small amount or large does not cancel the session. This triggered the max bet condition "over-bet rule" being violated."

-not on third deposit when the balance was zero !!

Hopefully someone will help me here

This problem seems to be unclear and we would kindly ask the Magical Spin Casino to be the part of this conversation. Since the player has been placing substantially large deposits, we would like to ask you to reconsider, and as a good will gesture , to make an exception for the player. If a player had more than one euro left in his account, we wouldn’t ask you to change your decision, but 63 cents is really an amount too small. Your help and understanding are highly appreciated in this matter. Thank you in advance.

Thank you hence no response from magical spin so far

Hi,

Our players are able to see within their personal cashier if there is a bonus balance left on the account. We operate on a very transparent level with our community.

With that being said, If there is a bonus balance left on the account and they make further deposits it does not make the bonus terms and conditions disappear. Our system automatically tracks this. We do not have any exceptions to this rule it is part of the agreement of receiving a bonus with Magical Spin. Especially since certain countries, as in this case, have no wagering requirements on the bonus.

This player ended her playing with a bonus balance showing of 75 Euros after winning on an active bonus. The player violated the terms and conditions by betting more than the 7.50 with an active bonus session that is clearly outlined in our terms and conditions and that she could clearly see in her cashier.

Please know, the casino's terms and conditions are clear in regards to over-bets when receiving a bonus balance.

Terms and conditions.

7.5 If a bonus has been claimed, the maximum bet allowed is €/CAD 7.5, over the entire game session relating to the deposit having benefited from the bonus (both real/bonus balances). This rule also applies to the free spins or bonus-games a player can buy directly from a game since the amount of the purchase is considered as the amount of the bet.

Levi H

Communications manager.

There is no way that this bonus of 75€ was still in my account as I lost it while depositing first time and using bonus and all was left after this session was 63 cents it’s not transparent at all as you can’t apply whole 75€ again if it was lost so even if this 63 cents was still there after second deposit there is no way it was there after third when my gains come from ,you simply cheating clients imposing sticky bonus which was played through and lost ,and btw my balance after depositing wasn’t higher and did not include this 75€ which you implying to ,this casino has cancelled my few winnings before after stalling that my account isn’t verified for weeks and putting my gains back to balance -no other casino does that ,believe me I have been playing in casinos for years and they all have bonus rules ,none of them applies sticky bonus which according to you wasn’t lost !!!! I will not leave this like that and will take different measures at least others will be warn not to play there certainly not French players

And no I couldn’t see anything on the cashier site as I’m playing on my mobile phone not on computer so this is another lie ,besides I can assure you there wasn’t bonus balance when I deposited third time ,I’m not sure about second but third I’m

And no your system does not track this all I was shown was some excel sheet which anyone can produce in 5 min ,I’m certainly very angry about this and regret depositing 500 euros in your cheating casino

Dear Magical Spin Casino,

I understand that you can do that based on casino terms, but we consider this situation as unfair and predator from the side of the casino.

Please reconsider one more time the case and consider all our suggestions.

Hi Juli,

I believe the player has made so many posts with false hoods that it has created some confusion.

Our casino does not have any predatory rules this is not a sticky bonus as it has no wagering requirements. and our bonus terms are clear on receiving a bonus and over-betting more than 7.50.

The rule is simple, while there is a bonus within your account, you agree to not bet more than 7.50 euros per bet.

How this would be considered predatory, I do not understand.

Also the players can clearly see this in their profile, cashier Bonus balance remaining, Cash Balance remaining.

See the screen shots below. This is a feature that has been in the Magical Spin for years because of this type issue. Total

Again the rule is clear while there is a bonus balance. "Session Open" you may not bet more than 7.50 This player clearly made over-bets. Which is the violation and our system automatically flags this.

Please see below Bonus Balance and Cash Balances are clearly displayed for all players.

I hope this clears any confusion.

Levi H

Communications manager.

I have not made any false statements ,so stop accusing me of that ,I have been playing in many casinos for many years hence never came across casino as yours ,like I stated before there wasn’t any bonus left after I spend it with my first deposit of €50 it was 63cents left and no there wasn’t any balance in my next or third deposit left from this bonus ,so it can only mean that you are imposing sticky bonus for many deposits ,it’s not clear if it was I wouldn’t bet more than 7.5 per spin which I believe did only for 5 or 6 spins during whole game as I’m not silly to lose my winnings hence I did not expect any bonus to be still in play while I lost it in the first around with 63 cents to be left ,so on second deposit maybe it was there ,hell no on third deposit.You should stop discrediting player reputation if you the one who’s manipulating here .I read of more than several cases in internet having trouble with cashing out or waiting for their winnings forever and getting splits payments means that this casino simply has no money and keeps delaying any payments .Of course if you were decent casino and respect players you wouldn’t behave like that ,so I will not leave this like that ,there are other measures people can take.I really regret spending my 500€ in this casino I should suspect that was the case from beginning when my first gains kept being cancelled and put into balance so player after weeks would play again and lose.This casino will do anything not to pay and no you can’t see this what you posted on mobile version as I looked

And btw 63 cents left wouldn’t still be as bonus after third deposit -ever ,no other casino in the world does that.And this lady keeps saying while there is a bonus in the account rules are simply -yes!!! Hence the bonus I got left after taking it with first deposit was 63 cents -it couldn’t be still in play after 2nd and third deposit -ok if we want to be so difficult maybe still was there for 2 min of playing with second deposit (being only 63c) but sure as hell couldn’t magically appear in third deposit

Hi,

This players session was cancelled by risk management for the violation and the deposit for the winning session was refunded to the player.

While we do empathize with the player regarding this issue, The player could clearly see that there was a bonus balance on the account yet chose to ignore it. we are unable to consider any other options. Not only because this issue has been made public and can affect the transparency of our casino, but also for legal reasons.

Players can not agree to the terms and conditions of the casino when they sign up, then decide to disagree if an issue arises. Make no mistake, we are also disheartened with this player's grievance, but the terms and conditions are a legally binding contract between players and online casinos for the casino's protection as well as the players.

Levi H

Communications manager

Your casino implies sticky bonus -stop talking about your terms and conditions which I understand but as I stated before bonus taken was spend almost all only 63 cents was left so it may been still there when I made 2nd deposit but it wasn’t for sure when I made a third ,so I’m not the one who is twisting your rules and stop disrespect me here implying that I accept it rules and now I’m trying to change it ,this behaviour is unacceptable as I’m honest player and never in my 15 years of playing with various casinos has issues or disregard their rules or terms ,this hopefully will have impact as others gave up to quickly and since this is public I certainly hope everyone is warned ,I’m extremely unlucky that I even use this bonus as usually I don’t take bonuses but that doesn’t give you the right to void all my winnings from non bonus deposit made third time when this initial bonus was not in play and NO I couldn’t clearly see this bonus after 3rd deposit because it wasn’t there !!

This casino is bending terms and conditions themselves just not to pay clients who won simple as that ,you can’t claim bonus being there after 3rd deposit as simply all was left after first deposit was 63 cents so it couldn’t whole €75 still be applied for next deposits but this is exactly what you are claiming to be true,this even sounds ridiculous and not other normal casino does that -yes if my winnings were from the deposit plus bonus you will be right about it but this isn’t the case here.

Hello Levi H and Joanna,

I'm sorry for the delay, we were consulting the case internally.

Purely from the legal perspective, the casino may be right. Hovewer, when making our ratings, we take many more factors into account. To pay out all winnings that are legitimate according to the T&Cs is a necessary condition for having a good rating, but not a sufficient one. There are many more factors to consider. One of these factors is the overall user experience, including whether the casino is safe. In our view, a good user experience means that players don’t need to read the full T&Cs (in fact nobody does that, maybe with the exception of some bonus hunters) and can rely that they’ll be treated fairly. In our view, safety means that it’s not easy to accidentally do something that will cancel your winnings.

Bonus maxbet is a standard rule, however many casual players don’t know about it. Because of this, we believe that the best thing to do is to enforce this condition using software. Only because this isn’t that easy for casinos to do, and almost no casino does this at the moment (we hope this will change in the future), we don’t penalize casinos for not having this feature. However, on the other hand, we expect the best casinos to individually look at every case where this rule may have been broken by an honest mistake.

The only reason for this rule’s existence is for casino to defend itself against bonus hunters. In this particular case, it’s clear that this rule was broken by accident and also that depositing with a balance of 63 cents doesn’t give the player any opportunity to abuse the bonus or get any other advantage over casino. So, this isn’t something that a bonus abuser would do. But it’s something that lots of casual players would do, unaware that it could have fatal effects on their future winnings. And we believe that the best casinos should create a safe environment for players and shouldn’t void their winnings because of honest mistakes like this.

If they do so, it may be justified from the legal perspective, but in our opinion, it’s not justified for casinos that care highly about their customers. Therefore, we ask Magical Spin Casino to look at this case from the player’s perspective and prove it cares also about player experience and not only about paragraphs.

Thank you Juli ,I’m certainly not any bonus abuser or trying to bend rules I’m only fighting what’s right and hopefully it will be noticed

We would like to ask the Magical Spin Casino to reply to this complaint. We are extending the timer by 7 days. If the casino fails to respond in the set time frame, we will close the complaint as ‘unresolved’.

Hi Casino Guru,

The players last deposit was refunded to the player. The session where terms and conditions were breached was closed.

Magical spins terms and conditions are clear on receiving a bonus. For transparency we even have an additional separated link for players to simply review our bonus terms and conditions. . https://www.magicalspin.com/bonus-terms - https://www.magicalspin.com/terms-and-conditions

The player admits to having a bonus balance of .63 on the account. When making further deposits.  The player session ended with 75.00 euros bonus balance on the account.  The bonus amount moves up and down when betting with a bonus.

The player could clearly see that there was a bonus balance. The player stated above she could not see a bonus balance but admitted to seeing that she had .63 bonus balance.

The player admits to betting more than 7.50 euros per bet. The evidence from the players account and betting history proves confirms this. 

This is not a personal account matter; this is about upholding the legality of our terms and conditions which apply to all players at all times in regard to our bonus system. The amount of bonus is irrelevant the fact that there was an amount is.

Following a careful review and consideration of all the information, by the parties during this complaint process and her admission, the Magical Spin Casino concluded that Magical Spin Casino’s risk management team acted in accordance with our Terms and Conditions.

Magical Spin Casino considers this matter closed.

Regards,

Levi H

Communications manager

Well I certainly hope that nobody will play in this casino I have explained numerous of times what exactly happened hence they still about their T&C which they have bended and the bonus is a sticky bonus as on my third deposit certainly 63 cents wasn’t there but they claiming it was still bonus in play.This casino also pays very slowly to other players if at all (search the web and you will find many opinions)-like someone who won 5k or more had to wait every week for portion of winnings meaning casino simply has no funds so the only way to cheat is to keep giving bonuses who apply to 100’s of deposits ,honest casinos don’t do that to players and help find a solution but not this casino.DO NOT DEPOSIT THERE if you want to see your money at all ,first takes forever to verify then they keep cancelling your withdrawals hoping you play again and lose !

Again lady the bonus was not in play on third deposit and can not apply -you can’t make whole 75€ from 63cents left !! Of course I admitted as there is nothing to hide here but you are the one who produce false statements -I already contacted gambling commission I may not get my winnings but you certainly won’t be freely cheating honest players !

Quote"The player could clearly see that there was a bonus balance. The player stated above she could not see a bonus balance but admitted to seeing that she had .63 bonus balance."

Not making a third deposit as simply wasn’t there anymore!!!

Btw I admitted to see my balance of 63cents not in bonus balance after first deposit so read with understanding next time

I do not think that this casino cares about customers at all ,they haven’t from beginning didn’t take any of my claims seriously as well as casino guru suggestions -all they kept saying was about their t&c even though they impose sticky bonus breaching their own T & C -warning to others don’t deposit one cent there ,their games are really great but you won’t get your winnings

One more interesting thing -she stated above herself that my bonus balance was 63p left -I lost that definitely on second deposit but hey suddenly on third deposit 63cents reappeared again and become 75€ again -so must be REAL MAGIC CASINO

Dear Magic Spin Casino,

Unfortunately, if you are unwilling to change your decision, we are forced to close this complaint as unresolved. You can reopen this complaint anytime.

Dear Joanna,

We are sorry that we couldn’t help you in this case. Your only option is to file a complaint with the licensing authority of the casino. Since, the casino has this rule in their T&Cs, we aren't convinced that you are going to succeed. But, we recommend you to try.

Best regards,

Juli

We’ve reopened this complaint as per the casino's request. We would like to give this case one more chance to get resolved and help both involved parties to reach to a satisfactory conclusion.

Dear Joanna,

the casino team has reached us, providing evidence to sustain their claims. I am very sorry about the situation, but based on your account history and communication in this thread, there are clear signs and patterns showing intentions of abuse. Unfortunately, we consider your case unjustified, and we are forced to reject your case.

You have full right not to agree with our decision. Another option is to file an official complaint at the licensing authority of the casino. I will gladly help you with it, you may reach me at the email address mentioned below. Please, be aware that this complaint will affect their reputation on our website. Let me know if you have any questions or require further assistance.

Best regards, Jozef

jozef.k@casino.guru